Re: Re: Greytalk Cooperative Project

Re: [greytalk] Re: Greytalk Cooperative Project
Tuesday, November 28, 2006 6:55 PM
From: "Marc-Tizoc González"
To: greytalk@canonfire.com

Great to see the list alive!

While I appreciate Joseph Bloch’s comment (and am excited to see him post!), one of Dungeon’s new ideas, the “Campaign Arc,” seems useful for the proposed project and much more viable than a GreyTalk Adventure Path. The Campaign Arc is basically a trilogy of adventures, much like the old modules’ series.

In addition to three adventures being more manageable than twelve, the smaller number of proposed adventures may encourage participation from people interested in different regions of the Flanaess. We could form one or more working groups, perhaps even inspiring each group by providing updates via the list.

As I count ‘em, six ideas have been contributed:

1. Basiliv’s list of locations, characters, and monsters;
2. Gerall Kahla’s suggestions re investigating UnderOerth or the Sea of Dust;
3. David Argall’s suggestion to start in Keoland before venturing west;
4. Aeolius’s suggestion re hags;
5. Scott Casper’s ordered list of locations; and
6. Scott’s ideas about old school monsters and specification re Furyondy and the Cold Marshes

Because I presently campaign in Sterich, I am generally more interested in the western Campaign Arc idea (starting in Keoland, venturing to the Yeomanry, and then into Slerotin’s Tunnel and the Sea of Dust). However, I’d prefer not to design an adventure into the Crystalmist-Hellfurances UnderOerth or the Sea of Dust, since they’ve already been explored in published modules, LGJ or OJ articles, or Randy Richards.

I propose adapting and integrating the ideas into the following:

Adventure 1: The PCs are raided by worg-riding goblins while traveling on a road in Bissel. The PCs best the goblins, but some NPC traveling companions are taken captive as the goblins flee. Following their trail, the PCs enter the nearby hills and find the goblins’ lair, which is based in old (Oeridian or Flan) ruins. The dungeon beneath the ruins is controlled by lamia(s) (noble?), which dominate the goblins.

If successful, the PCs recover their traveling companions, learn that one of them is a nobles’ scion, and return her/him to her/his ancestral keep, thus gaining a noble patron. The PCs may also find signs that indicate the involvement of the Horned Society

Adventure 2: The noble asks the PCs to investigate the ruins further. While doing so, they are meet a small expedition commissioned by Evard the Black (a fact initially unknown to the PCs) to investigate the ruins. If the PCs are hostile, the NPC party responds in kind. If the PCs cooperate, the NPC party repays the PCs by asking their further help with a nearby fort (in the Bramblewood?). Along the way, the parties encounter kech, giant spiders, and ettercap. If the PCs defeat these monsters, they attract the attention of the hag covey that oversees this part of the woods.

At the fort, the PCs learn that kobolds are assembling significant warbands, apparently intending to raid into the Highvale. Skirmishing with or scouting them, the PCs are separated from the remaining NPCs. Should the PCs return to their noble patron in Bissel, she or he sends them back, as scouts for a larger force. Should the PCs act otherwise, eventually they should enter the Highvale and help defeat the kobold raiders, reuniting with the remaining NPCs, and meeting an elven sage in Highfolk, who informs them about the hag covey in the Bramblewood, discusses what the PCs have learned about the Horned Society, and attempts to recruit the PCs to investigate the hag covey.

Adventure 3: The PCs attempt to locate the Bramblewood hag covey, whether they were persuaded by the Highfolk sage or so instructed by their noble patron (who has unknown to the PCs become dominated by a lamia noble that is antagonistic to the covey).

Their discovery of the covey’s apparent cave domicile leads them beneath the mountains, where they encounter at least one roper and unwittingly enter a conflict between illithids, githzerai (or githyanki), and cloakers. The PCs may tip the balance or be smashed on the scales. Additionally, they may find the remaining hags (who have fled the surface due to the lamia noble’s machinations) to be implacable enemies or wary allies.

After significant conflict, the PCs fight their way to the surface and find themselves in Perrenland, near Lake Quag.

***

I’ve run out of time to produce ideas for how to connect this part of the adventure to the Cold Marshes and to incorporate further ancient Flan or Baklunish cultures.

I really like Scott’s suggestions regarding the conflict between the Blackwater hag covey and Iuz!

MTG


Scott wrote:

Hi all,

Public interest in the new cooperative project seems to have died off already, or at least publicly. Still...

"Aeolius" wrote:
>In BPAA, I devised the Covyn; three hag coveys, one epic-level
covey, and one leader - 13 hags in all.

>As far as other hags go I've been working on a few, starting with
the squalus. Much as a winter hag is the offspring of a greenhag and
ice troll and the dune hag is born of the union between wasteland
troll and greenhag, the shoal hag or squalus is parented by a
greenhag and scrag.

>I'm also revamping my Blackwater (new domain from Stormwrack)
hags. Envision the remains of a slain sea hag covey, animated into a
single undead creature by Blackwater. I got my inspiration for the
three-made-one from this: http://www.designtoscano.com/images/us/
local/products/viewlarger/DB51037_vl.jpg Considering how many hags I
am likely to unleash upon Turucambi, I think the Blackwater Hag will
be [expletive deleted]-bent upon slaying her living sisters.<

Perhaps one of these coven of hags has come to Furyondy to kidnap someone important (the Viscount of the March? his wife?) and take him deep into Iuz's territory. Everyone will assume this is Iuz's plot, but Iuz's forces are after the hags too to get their hands on their prisoner. The hags are actually delivering a sacrifice to a blackwater hag in the Cold Marshes. In exchange for the sacrifice, the blackwater hag will stop trying to kill the other hags.

Anyone interested in working on that?

~Scott "-enkainen" Casper

Re: Geographic and political absurdities or why the xoom Keoland writeup bites

Date: Tue, 09 Nov 99 14:04PM PST
From: Taras Cranden-Guarhoth
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Geographic and political absurdities or why the xoom Keoland writeup bites

> I'll look into the two less outrageous of the claims:

First of all, the author has stated that while based on canon, it's not completely canon.

> a) the Brotherhood has superiority on the seas. Any naval campaign is going to be a lost cause unless the brotherhood's control of the seas can be broken. Unfortunately, there is no easy way out
> on this one, as unlike demons, there is nothing to send the numerous seamonsters back into the depths. All the weirdos and pirates on the costs of the Jerlea bay aren't likely to be of
> tremendous help and are not likely to mount a big united campaign.
> Keoland does not have the option of an allout naval campaign against the Brotherhood, as it would leave their coast and ports
> open to the brotherhood forces coming from say the lordship of the isles. Similarily, if the keolandish naval forces do not gain a definate upper hand, they may get pitched between two
> brotherhood forces in the Jerlea Bay.

Flaw: This assumes that there's nothing else, like, say the Sea Barons, Nyrond, Ahlissa, not to mention that big blockade they're trying to run (it's gotta be tough to blockade such a huge expanse of open water). The moment the SB and their lackeys went ahead and tried to concentrate fully on something like overpowering Keoland navally, everyone else would notice the sudden drop in SB activity, and pounce. I think the SB would be less likely to interfere with Keoland invading a province they've pretty much lost if it'd mean they'd face increaded raids within provinces that they're not losing and are a lot closer to home.

> b) the hool marshes is a possibility, but it would have very grim results. Hool marshes are after all a big part of what has kept the Keoland out of there for so long. Just about the only way
> of moving large amounts of troops through the Hool Marches would be building special roads - most probably from treetrunks -
> over which the troops could move. Reinforcements and supplies would be a severe problem, especially should something happen to the long marsh road (which does not require all that high
> level mage). The army also has the chance of the road being destroyed at which point they are stuck in the middle of a large marsh with limited supplies...

IIRC, Keoland already went through the Hools to invade the Sea Princes once.
So it CAN be done. Plus, they could go by barge down the Javan, making the amount of marshlands that they'd need to cross significantly less.

> That all above there assumes that the locals in the Hold do not side with the Brotherhood against the new enemy - the Keoland. Keoland and the Hold have never had particularily good relations, and while they probably would at least initally cheer anybody fighting the Brotherhood, there is no
> reason to think that they like Keoland even a tiny bit more than the Brotherhood.

The locals consist of a rather large variety of peoples...Olman and Amedian savages, natives of the Sea Princes, slaves taken from around the Flanaess who were owned by the Sea Princes or Scarlet Brotherhood...I think the Keoish would face less opposition than you'd think. After all, the Olman detest the Brotherhood, as does anyone of non-Suel extraction. That alone would make them more inclined to side with the Keoish. As for the native Holders, well, considering that they all got made slaves by the SB, they'd probabily be a bit more inclined to side with the Keoish, in the hopes of getting some power back. I doubt too many would rebel against a well-trained Keoish army. But a lot may conspire behind the scenes.

> The inital cheering would soon be replaced by backstabing and sabotage.

Sounds like the makings of a campaign. And, of course, since each petty noble wants to rule a free Sea Princes, they wouldn't want to let the plans of the other nobles succeed.

> a) has a lot of dissent against any further wars due to excessive losses, inc. back at home (assassinations, etc.)

Well, there WAS a civil war, providing we're thinking of the same page.

> c) must hold in check a very troublesome new province.

And? Like the SB didn't have to hold in check a very troublesome province? That's just a fact of conquering.

> a) Yeomanry is bound to dislike the presence of Keoland on more than one of it's borders and would naturally provide help - whetever offical or not - to any dissent in Sterich.

The Yeomanry would be disinclined to do much of anything against Keoland. They do best in defense, by arming everyone. Now, if they took all these new troops to war, they'd run out of food, since they'd basically empty their country in order to use their main advantage.

> b) The Sterich refugees are bound to dislike any military action in Sterich that does not involve them, and a military action involving them will not lead to Sterich becoming part of
> Keoland.

Sterich refugees are a non-factor. A) They couldn't hold their own country in the first place. B) They are scattered about all over the place. Not all of them went to Keoland. In fact, those that had the least love for the Keoish were probabily those who went the farthest from Keoland. Those who saw Keoland as a strong, protective land that could keep them safe were probabily those who fled to Keoland.

> c) Gran Marsh, Veluna and the Ulek states are bound to strongly oppose any attempts of Keoland to annex Sterich. As Keoland cannot allow itself to be put to the situation that all it's
> neighbours have many axes to grind with it, it will not be able to undertake it. It would just not survive if its border areas and Good Hills decided to leave. It would immediately leave to
> the rest of the Keoland being split into three separate parts.

He's already stated that the three Uleks were backing Keoland. And as for Veluna, it's a non-issue. Veluna has two countries between in and Keoland. I seriously doubt they're worrying about Keoland with Ket on their border and a war with Iuz going on in their backyard (Furyondy). Which just leaves the Gran March. If the Gran March has any intelligence, it'd shut up, given that Ket's running around to the north, Veluna is distracted, and the Uleks have sided with the Keoish...leaves them pretty much alone and vulnerable...wouldn't want to give those Keoish any reason to invade, now would we? And the Good Hills...IIRC, that's the area that broke away in the civil war and had to be, erm, pacified.

> d) instead of guarding a border along a river Keoland will get new borders, inc. a very extensive border with Geoff and in the mountains, and will have to guard it against further incursions
> by giants, etc.

Which I'm sure Keoland is more than capabale of. After all, if the threats in the 591 CY era aren't so great as to stop the Sterich from doing it canonically, there wouldn't be enough to bother the Keoish from doing it in the same timeframe.

> C. Getting the Ulek States under it's banner. Yeah, right. And both Demogorgon and Grazzt reformed themselves and are now living on the plains of Elusium with other good gods...

If you disagree with his heresies, that's fine. But there's no need to discourage him from posting by mocking him. It speaks more about you than it does about him.

> Where Keoland would get all those resources that would take is another matter entirely.

Let's see...it's a big country...it was the only big country that wasn't directly involved in the Wars which troubled so much of the Flanaess a while back...odds are, it already had the resources. Gearing itself up for the next round so that it wouldn't get caught off guard like Furyondy (or worse, Tenh) were. It just decided to put the war into it's own terms, and on other people's soil, instead of it's own.

==
Taras Guarhoth, Sage of House Cranden
http://www.bestweb.net/~guarhoth/