Showing posts with label Humor. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Humor. Show all posts
Saturday, December 14, 2024
Monday, December 7, 2009
Re: greytalk Digest 24 Nov 2009 04:14:43 -0000 Issue 1134
Re: greytalk Digest 24 Nov 2009 04:14:43 -0000 Issue 1134
Monday, November 23, 2009 11:18 PM
From: "Brian McRae"
To: greytalk-digest-help@canonfire.com
Cc: greytalk@canonfire.com
Reminds me of something that a scholarly wizard did in my campaign. The wizard chronicled his adventures through the Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun in great detail, and had 200 hand-scribed copies made at great expense. He was amazed at how quickly the copies sold. After a visit from representatives of some very powerful and influential religions and arch-mages. He kind of understood that the books were likely being studied by top men. Top men.
As to printing, wood block print would work well, and even simple movable type(wood letter blocks in a frame) is doable. However, with spells like copy(a dirt cheap 1st level spell from the 2e "Wizard's Handbook") in existence, if it does exist in a particular DM's campaign, circulating even books becomes much more simple. Now, with regards to movable type, it would take even less time and expense to just have a spell caster cast a spell that changes the shape of the wood block stamp to be embossed with reverse images of the required type/images, and then you just print as much as you want to. Simple tech more easily implemented by the simple application of magic.
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:14 PM, wrote:
greytalk Digest 24 Nov 2009 04:14:43 -0000 Issue 1134
Topics (messages 13419 through 13422):
Re: Greyhawk Grumbler
13419 by: ukegreg
13420 by: Kent Goertzen
13421 by: Chris Anderson
13422 by: Tracy Johnson
Administrivia:
To subscribe to the digest, e-mail:
greytalk-digest-subscribe@canonfire.com
To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail:
greytalk-digest-unsubscribe@canonfire.com
To post to the list, e-mail:
greytalk@canonfire.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "ukegreg"
To: "'greytalk'"
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:50:27 -0800
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
If you want historical precedent for printing I recommend “woodblock prints”. You take a block of wood and carve it into a huge ink stamp basically. The effort it takes to create a set of hardwood plates for one ‘book’ is enormous though. Only major religions and/or countries would bother, and then only for super important books.
I agree with the others that an easily modifiable mass-produced newspaper is probably beyond the scope of the setting. Ideally technology should advance to prevent a setting from stagnating, but if you aren’t careful you might ruin the atmosphere. It’s also worth noting that there are some VERY smart villains in the campaign setting who would feel threatened by a printing press and try to subvert or destroy it immediately. If you’ve got PC’s running it they might get in serious trouble for printing the wrong thing. Imagine the party bard composing some super-motivational “Anti-Iuz” article and then spreading two hundred thousand copies throughout the Flanaess…
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
From: Vest III, Robert W [mailto:rvest@ius.edu]
Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 12:15 PM
To: 'greytalk'
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
There is actually a canonical precedent for having printing presses in the Flanaess. See the Age of Worms backdrop article on Alhaster (Dungeon 131), which mentions an underground broadsheet in Alhaster called The Sinchaser Report.
From: CJ MacLean [mailto:icar@shaw.ca]
Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 3:04 PM
To: 'greytalk'
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
From: Wade Nolen [mailto:icarusatb@yahoo.com]
"I’m beginning to think that people aren’t listening to points being made, because all three of these have been refuted, over and over."
Me too. The kind of broadsheet designed to be read by thousands of people didn't happen until the mechanized printing press. Commoners didn't have access to newspapers until the 19th century, even now in unindustrialized nations newspapers can be hard to find because paper isn't a commodity that is easy to get or make without industrialization/motorization.
The examples that you keep pulling out to defend your arguments are edicts or proclamations that were read by an official and then posted in a public place, NOT given to every commoner to read. Even the later broadsheets were for merchants and the upper class not for lower caste society.
In game terms paper is costly, depending on where you look a single sheet is 1gp or more. To circulate a paper of 5000 copies (a reasonable amount given Greyhawks size) and sell it for a copper piece would mean a massive loss per issue. This cost doesn't reflect the cost of the machine/spell/scribes/time/ink/retailers that would also be needed to make the newspaper exist. No one could afford to take this loss, and no powerful businessman would lose this cash when they can hire a bard, beggar, crier, or rumormonger to get the information out at a fraction of the cost.
A newspaper doesn't make business sense, It would most likely be suppressed by the government, and while it may be historically possible to create a broadsheet, it isn't historically possible to have the circulation it would need to reach a debatably literate peasant population.
CJ
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Kent Goertzen
To:
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 13:46:49 -0600
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
Time, effort (woodblock prints for example), and cost (paper really wouldn't be cheap in that period), would really prohibit it.
As far as a setting precedent, Forgotten Realms right before the switch to 4e Chapbooks filtering around Water deep weren't uncommon. But only those who were wealthy were really able to afford to produce them. Not sure what time period you've moved forward to. Living Greyhawk would probably be a 200-400 years behind where Forgotten Realms was in terms of technological advancement. Where FR is closer to 15th-17th century and GH closer to 13th-14th imo.
Kent Goertzen
From: ukegreg@yahoo.com
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Lol, :D
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. Try it now.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Chris Anderson
To: Kent Goertzen
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 17:34:38 -0800
Subject: Re: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
Paper costs are not a problem. They are based on historical western European paper costs... so you would think that they are accurate, but they're not.
Western Europeans lost access to cheap writing paper when the Mediterranean was blockaded by the Arabs in the 700's. Papyrus is extremely cheap to make, lasts a long time, and is able to be printed on. However, when Islam took away Egypt and northern Africa, and conquered Spain, western Europe lost access to papyrus.
As a result, they turned to vellum/parchment... which is a processed animal hide. Making vellum is expensive in time, materials, and skills. So much so, that vellum was traditionally reused by scraping it clean of ink.
Rag paper was a closely guarded secret that traveled from China. Those who knew how to make it forced you to pay dearly for it... they could do this because there was no cheaper alternative. Prices for rag paper were relatively low in the middle east, because it had to compete with papyrus. They were higher in western Europe because the only competition was vellum/parchment.
So, without the Arab blockade of the Mediterranean, prices for paper in western Europe would not have been high.
You can tell this because costs of paper in Roman times were low... because trade flowed freely to Egypt. However, costs of paper in Italy during the middle ages was high, because there was no trade to Egypt.
Now, in Greyhawk, there is no Arab blockade. Trade flows freely (with some local exceptions). There is no need for high paper prices due to artificial shortages.
Woodblocks are not costly to make compared to copyists, and there is a really, really good reason to use them instead of copyists: reducing mistakes.
Copyists produced many grammar and subject matter mistakes due to the process. During Carolingian times, this was such a problem that new fonts, grammar, and punctuation were introduced in an effort to reduce copyist mistakes.
Woodblocks, once they're correct, are perfect time and again until the wood is pressed down over time and it has to be created again.
Now for rapidly changing news, I would agree that carving a woodblock over the course of a day to tell the day's news won't happen. But for news that needs to be reproduced exactly, or for holy books, or for items which must not have mistakes, it's a perfect solution.
-- Chris
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:46 AM, Kent Goertzen wrote:
Time, effort (woodblock prints for example), and cost (paper really wouldn't be cheap in that period), would really prohibit it.
As far as a setting precedent, Forgotten Realms right before the switch to 4e Chapbooks filtering around Water deep weren't uncommon. But only those who were wealthy were really able to afford to produce them. Not sure what time period you've moved forward to. Living Greyhawk would probably be a 200-400 years behind where Forgotten Realms was in terms of technological advancement. Where FR is closer to 15th-17th century and GH closer to 13th-14th imo.
Kent Goertzen
From: ukegreg@yahoo.com
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Lol, :D
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. Try it now.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Tracy Johnson
To: greytalk list
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 21:38:30 -0500
Subject: Re: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 17:34 -0800, Chris Anderson wrote:
> Paper costs are not a problem. They are based on historical western
> European paper costs... so you would think that they are accurate, but
> they're not.
>
I don't think it matters as far as a Fantasy setting is concerned. The
overuse of magic bypassed the use of paper. I compare this to the
ubiquitous rise of today's Internet. Because of it, the traditional
newspaper is failing, because they cannot find a business model that
will support paper. (Similar to game companies that publish paper are
going under.)
Much in the same way, the all-pervasive use of scrying, seeking,
clairvoyant, clairaudience type of magic doesn't not allow a newspaper
business model to develop, because the opportunity was bypassed.
Besides, there are easier ways to find news in Greyhawk!
As was noticed on by an intern looking over the shoulder of Otiluke in
standing before one of the numerous Palantir's at the Greyhawk school of
magic library:
...
--
BT
Tracy Johnson
Old telnet games at 198.212.189.111
NNNN
Monday, November 23, 2009 11:18 PM
From: "Brian McRae"
To: greytalk-digest-help@canonfire.com
Cc: greytalk@canonfire.com
Reminds me of something that a scholarly wizard did in my campaign. The wizard chronicled his adventures through the Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun in great detail, and had 200 hand-scribed copies made at great expense. He was amazed at how quickly the copies sold. After a visit from representatives of some very powerful and influential religions and arch-mages. He kind of understood that the books were likely being studied by top men. Top men.
As to printing, wood block print would work well, and even simple movable type(wood letter blocks in a frame) is doable. However, with spells like copy(a dirt cheap 1st level spell from the 2e "Wizard's Handbook") in existence, if it does exist in a particular DM's campaign, circulating even books becomes much more simple. Now, with regards to movable type, it would take even less time and expense to just have a spell caster cast a spell that changes the shape of the wood block stamp to be embossed with reverse images of the required type/images, and then you just print as much as you want to. Simple tech more easily implemented by the simple application of magic.
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 8:14 PM,
greytalk Digest 24 Nov 2009 04:14:43 -0000 Issue 1134
Topics (messages 13419 through 13422):
Re: Greyhawk Grumbler
13419 by: ukegreg
13420 by: Kent Goertzen
13421 by: Chris Anderson
13422 by: Tracy Johnson
Administrivia:
To subscribe to the digest, e-mail:
greytalk-digest-subscribe@canonfire.com
To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail:
greytalk-digest-unsubscribe@canonfire.com
To post to the list, e-mail:
greytalk@canonfire.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "ukegreg"
To: "'greytalk'"
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:50:27 -0800
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
If you want historical precedent for printing I recommend “woodblock prints”. You take a block of wood and carve it into a huge ink stamp basically. The effort it takes to create a set of hardwood plates for one ‘book’ is enormous though. Only major religions and/or countries would bother, and then only for super important books.
I agree with the others that an easily modifiable mass-produced newspaper is probably beyond the scope of the setting. Ideally technology should advance to prevent a setting from stagnating, but if you aren’t careful you might ruin the atmosphere. It’s also worth noting that there are some VERY smart villains in the campaign setting who would feel threatened by a printing press and try to subvert or destroy it immediately. If you’ve got PC’s running it they might get in serious trouble for printing the wrong thing. Imagine the party bard composing some super-motivational “Anti-Iuz” article and then spreading two hundred thousand copies throughout the Flanaess…
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
From: Vest III, Robert W [mailto:rvest@ius.edu]
Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 12:15 PM
To: 'greytalk'
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
There is actually a canonical precedent for having printing presses in the Flanaess. See the Age of Worms backdrop article on Alhaster (Dungeon 131), which mentions an underground broadsheet in Alhaster called The Sinchaser Report.
From: CJ MacLean [mailto:icar@shaw.ca]
Sent: Sunday, November 15, 2009 3:04 PM
To: 'greytalk'
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
From: Wade Nolen [mailto:icarusatb@yahoo.com]
"I’m beginning to think that people aren’t listening to points being made, because all three of these have been refuted, over and over."
Me too. The kind of broadsheet designed to be read by thousands of people didn't happen until the mechanized printing press. Commoners didn't have access to newspapers until the 19th century, even now in unindustrialized nations newspapers can be hard to find because paper isn't a commodity that is easy to get or make without industrialization/motorization.
The examples that you keep pulling out to defend your arguments are edicts or proclamations that were read by an official and then posted in a public place, NOT given to every commoner to read. Even the later broadsheets were for merchants and the upper class not for lower caste society.
In game terms paper is costly, depending on where you look a single sheet is 1gp or more. To circulate a paper of 5000 copies (a reasonable amount given Greyhawks size) and sell it for a copper piece would mean a massive loss per issue. This cost doesn't reflect the cost of the machine/spell/scribes/time/ink/retailers that would also be needed to make the newspaper exist. No one could afford to take this loss, and no powerful businessman would lose this cash when they can hire a bard, beggar, crier, or rumormonger to get the information out at a fraction of the cost.
A newspaper doesn't make business sense, It would most likely be suppressed by the government, and while it may be historically possible to create a broadsheet, it isn't historically possible to have the circulation it would need to reach a debatably literate peasant population.
CJ
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Kent Goertzen
To:
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 13:46:49 -0600
Subject: RE: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
Time, effort (woodblock prints for example), and cost (paper really wouldn't be cheap in that period), would really prohibit it.
As far as a setting precedent, Forgotten Realms right before the switch to 4e Chapbooks filtering around Water deep weren't uncommon. But only those who were wealthy were really able to afford to produce them. Not sure what time period you've moved forward to. Living Greyhawk would probably be a 200-400 years behind where Forgotten Realms was in terms of technological advancement. Where FR is closer to 15th-17th century and GH closer to 13th-14th imo.
Kent Goertzen
From: ukegreg@yahoo.com
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Lol, :D
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. Try it now.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Chris Anderson
To: Kent Goertzen
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 17:34:38 -0800
Subject: Re: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
Paper costs are not a problem. They are based on historical western European paper costs... so you would think that they are accurate, but they're not.
Western Europeans lost access to cheap writing paper when the Mediterranean was blockaded by the Arabs in the 700's. Papyrus is extremely cheap to make, lasts a long time, and is able to be printed on. However, when Islam took away Egypt and northern Africa, and conquered Spain, western Europe lost access to papyrus.
As a result, they turned to vellum/parchment... which is a processed animal hide. Making vellum is expensive in time, materials, and skills. So much so, that vellum was traditionally reused by scraping it clean of ink.
Rag paper was a closely guarded secret that traveled from China. Those who knew how to make it forced you to pay dearly for it... they could do this because there was no cheaper alternative. Prices for rag paper were relatively low in the middle east, because it had to compete with papyrus. They were higher in western Europe because the only competition was vellum/parchment.
So, without the Arab blockade of the Mediterranean, prices for paper in western Europe would not have been high.
You can tell this because costs of paper in Roman times were low... because trade flowed freely to Egypt. However, costs of paper in Italy during the middle ages was high, because there was no trade to Egypt.
Now, in Greyhawk, there is no Arab blockade. Trade flows freely (with some local exceptions). There is no need for high paper prices due to artificial shortages.
Woodblocks are not costly to make compared to copyists, and there is a really, really good reason to use them instead of copyists: reducing mistakes.
Copyists produced many grammar and subject matter mistakes due to the process. During Carolingian times, this was such a problem that new fonts, grammar, and punctuation were introduced in an effort to reduce copyist mistakes.
Woodblocks, once they're correct, are perfect time and again until the wood is pressed down over time and it has to be created again.
Now for rapidly changing news, I would agree that carving a woodblock over the course of a day to tell the day's news won't happen. But for news that needs to be reproduced exactly, or for holy books, or for items which must not have mistakes, it's a perfect solution.
-- Chris
On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:46 AM, Kent Goertzen
Time, effort (woodblock prints for example), and cost (paper really wouldn't be cheap in that period), would really prohibit it.
As far as a setting precedent, Forgotten Realms right before the switch to 4e Chapbooks filtering around Water deep weren't uncommon. But only those who were wealthy were really able to afford to produce them. Not sure what time period you've moved forward to. Living Greyhawk would probably be a 200-400 years behind where Forgotten Realms was in terms of technological advancement. Where FR is closer to 15th-17th century and GH closer to 13th-14th imo.
Kent Goertzen
From: ukegreg@yahoo.com
“Master, you need to have a look at this…”
“WHERE THE HELL DID THIS COME FROM!?”
“I guess there’s some guy in Greyhawk City making them.”
“HOW LONG HAS THIS BEEN GOING ON!?”
“Couple of months I guess. He’s got this really talented bard doing the illustrations.”
“ILLUSTRATIONS!?”
“Yep. There’s a naked tri-fold drawing of your mom on page 17. Apparently Iggwilv made scantily-clad-sorceress of the month. They’re calling her ‘Miss Fireseek’. We’ve seen them pinned-up in every barracks in Furyo-”
“FIIIIIIND HIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!”
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Lol, :D
Bing brings you maps, menus, and reviews organized in one place. Try it now.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Tracy Johnson
To: greytalk list
Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2009 21:38:30 -0500
Subject: Re: [greytalk] Greyhawk Grumbler
On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 17:34 -0800, Chris Anderson wrote:
> Paper costs are not a problem. They are based on historical western
> European paper costs... so you would think that they are accurate, but
> they're not.
>
I don't think it matters as far as a Fantasy setting is concerned. The
overuse of magic bypassed the use of paper. I compare this to the
ubiquitous rise of today's Internet. Because of it, the traditional
newspaper is failing, because they cannot find a business model that
will support paper. (Similar to game companies that publish paper are
going under.)
Much in the same way, the all-pervasive use of scrying, seeking,
clairvoyant, clairaudience type of magic doesn't not allow a newspaper
business model to develop, because the opportunity was bypassed.
Besides, there are easier ways to find news in Greyhawk!
As was noticed on by an intern looking over the shoulder of Otiluke in
standing before one of the numerous Palantir's at the Greyhawk school of
magic library:
...
--
BT
Tracy Johnson
Old telnet games at 198.212.189.111
NNNN
Wednesday, September 9, 2009
Re: Listonyms
Date: Thu, 05 Aug 99 12:07PM PDT
From: yehoota@ATT.NET Add To Address Book Add To Junk Mail Blocker List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Listonyms
>Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 03:53:21 -0400
>From: "d.k. tetreault"
>Subject: Listonyms
>>>On Tue, 22 Jun 1999, Gary R Welsh wrote:
>>> On Tue, 22 Jun 1999, Scott Casper wrote:
>>>> > >* Tetreultian is an adjective designating an attitude of historical scepticism, with shadings of both amusement and disdain.
>> >
>> > While Denis is probably honored to have an adjective in his honor, isn't it missing an "a?"
>>
>> Whoops. My mistake. I've never been good with those French names. Sorry Denis (I note the one "n") -- the adjective should be spelled "tetreaultian."
>
>Haahahaaa!!!! I feel positively Iquanderian*
>
>*Note: "Iquanderian" is defined here as feeling "honored, in an ambiguously dubious sort of way" ;-)
>
>Other listonyms...
>
>Gygaxian - to speak in excessively flowery prose, in print and in everyday
> life (this was almost certainly the FIRST listonym ever)
>Weissian - to be heretical, not for a cause but for the sake of being heretical
>Screedian - to be insultingly antagonistic just because your a miserable bastard and like to set off flamewars
>Holianian - to be quietly bemused and non-reactive at the folies and
> bickering of others
>
>I had a few others, even better, but in fit of nobility deleted them, because I'm sure some people wouldn't take it well. Russ, Nathanael and
>Keldreth can thank me later. ;-)
AND
>
>Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 22:59:42 -0400
>From: Samuel Weiss
>Subject: Re: Listonyms
>
>Your forgot:
>
>Maldinian - to reject perfectly good ideas like canals and hobloggers out of
>fear of their uniqueness and originality.
>:-P
>
>Samwise of Pelor
>
HEYYY!!! I WANT ONE TOO!!!!
Lesseee....
Loonarian: To go off on wingnut tangents and whiny rants with no sense of reason whatsoever, except to alleviate a quivering palm...
If you want something done, you have to do it yourself!
Anthony "Looney" Toohey
Theryn of Nowhere
Ah, the good old days, when men were men, and gods had hit points!
From: yehoota@ATT.NET Add To Address Book Add To Junk Mail Blocker List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Listonyms
>Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 03:53:21 -0400
>From: "d.k. tetreault"
>Subject: Listonyms
>>>On Tue, 22 Jun 1999, Gary R Welsh wrote:
>>> On Tue, 22 Jun 1999, Scott Casper wrote:
>>>> > >* Tetreultian is an adjective designating an attitude of historical scepticism, with shadings of both amusement and disdain.
>> >
>> > While Denis is probably honored to have an adjective in his honor, isn't it missing an "a?"
>>
>> Whoops. My mistake. I've never been good with those French names. Sorry Denis (I note the one "n") -- the adjective should be spelled "tetreaultian."
>
>Haahahaaa!!!! I feel positively Iquanderian*
>
>*Note: "Iquanderian" is defined here as feeling "honored, in an ambiguously dubious sort of way" ;-)
>
>Other listonyms...
>
>Gygaxian - to speak in excessively flowery prose, in print and in everyday
> life (this was almost certainly the FIRST listonym ever)
>Weissian - to be heretical, not for a cause but for the sake of being heretical
>Screedian - to be insultingly antagonistic just because your a miserable bastard and like to set off flamewars
>Holianian - to be quietly bemused and non-reactive at the folies and
> bickering of others
>
>I had a few others, even better, but in fit of nobility deleted them, because I'm sure some people wouldn't take it well. Russ, Nathanael and
>Keldreth can thank me later. ;-)
AND
>
>Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 22:59:42 -0400
>From: Samuel Weiss
>Subject: Re: Listonyms
>
>Your forgot:
>
>Maldinian - to reject perfectly good ideas like canals and hobloggers out of
>fear of their uniqueness and originality.
>:-P
>
>Samwise of Pelor
>
HEYYY!!! I WANT ONE TOO!!!!
Lesseee....
Loonarian: To go off on wingnut tangents and whiny rants with no sense of reason whatsoever, except to alleviate a quivering palm...
If you want something done, you have to do it yourself!
Anthony "Looney" Toohey
Theryn of Nowhere
Ah, the good old days, when men were men, and gods had hit points!
Sunday, June 28, 2009
My absense, humanoid origins, Vatun, and cow
Priority: normal
Date sent: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:40:12 CST
Send reply to: The GREYtalk Discussion List
From: SCOTT CASPER
Organization: Dominican Univ., River Forest, IL
Subject: [GREYTALK] My absense, humanoid origins, Vatun, and cow
Originally to: greytalk@MIT.EDU
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Yes! I'm finally back! For those of you who didn't notice, I've been gone for a month. For the first week, I was working on mid-terms. The second week I was catching up with the first week. Since then, something was wrong with my e-mail and I wasn't able to send anything no matter what I did. I owe one or two personal e-mails I intend to get to in the next few days. Of course, there are those among you who, for bizarre reasons, found my guns and plumbing threads boring and probably wished I'd stay silent. Well, to that I say – TOUGH!
Since I've been sitting here quietly for the past month unable to comment, I'm way behind on all the current threads. I intend to throw my opinions once more into the cyber-wind soon enough, but for now I thought I'd just share some musings I've had. These ideas are way out there, and I'm not even sure I'll be using them yet. Still, I wanted to share them and see what people thought.
First off, my idea about humanoid origins was this. What if, way back after the Invoked Devastation, the hordelings didn't leave right away. Recent postings have argued about whether summoning has a time limit. What if the hordelings stayed, molested the Oerdians, and the product of these hordeling-human unions gradually produced the orcs, trolls, and kobolds we all know (and love) today?
Secondly, this occurred to me at about the same time. What if the Vatun disguise of Iuz's was not Iuz's idea? A lot of gods were probably happy with his incarceration under Castle Greyhawk. What if they schemed to check the demi-god again? Zagyg, Cuthbert, and maybe some other lesser gods or quasi-deities kidnapped Iuz, forced amnesia on him, and told him he was the lost god Vatun? They got the Suel gods to go along with this, and that is why divination never revealed the Vatun deception.
There is one other thing I could use comments on. I am still working on my Monster Manual revisions (to the exclusion of far too much), and I just recently got to my Cattle entry. Has anyone given any thought to what breeds of cow may be found in the Flanaess? Can someone from Europe give me some names of European breeds of cow?
So far, I have developed three varieties of cow. There is the common (2 HD) Flannish cow. There is the smaller (1 HD) Kettish (or elven) cow which is considered excellent livestock. Then there is the Ideish cow (3 HD) which is strong enough to pull wagons, plows, and can even be rode like a mount (borrowed from the comicbook BONE). Is “Ideish” the word you would use to describe something from Idee?
Scott “Volstagg” Casper
Have fun in Brazil, Erik! Never mind that you've left me with one less Call of Cthulu player!
Date sent: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:40:12 CST
Send reply to: The GREYtalk Discussion List
From: SCOTT CASPER
Organization: Dominican Univ., River Forest, IL
Subject: [GREYTALK] My absense, humanoid origins, Vatun, and cow
Originally to: greytalk@MIT.EDU
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Yes! I'm finally back! For those of you who didn't notice, I've been gone for a month. For the first week, I was working on mid-terms. The second week I was catching up with the first week. Since then, something was wrong with my e-mail and I wasn't able to send anything no matter what I did. I owe one or two personal e-mails I intend to get to in the next few days. Of course, there are those among you who, for bizarre reasons, found my guns and plumbing threads boring and probably wished I'd stay silent. Well, to that I say – TOUGH!
Since I've been sitting here quietly for the past month unable to comment, I'm way behind on all the current threads. I intend to throw my opinions once more into the cyber-wind soon enough, but for now I thought I'd just share some musings I've had. These ideas are way out there, and I'm not even sure I'll be using them yet. Still, I wanted to share them and see what people thought.
First off, my idea about humanoid origins was this. What if, way back after the Invoked Devastation, the hordelings didn't leave right away. Recent postings have argued about whether summoning has a time limit. What if the hordelings stayed, molested the Oerdians, and the product of these hordeling-human unions gradually produced the orcs, trolls, and kobolds we all know (and love) today?
Secondly, this occurred to me at about the same time. What if the Vatun disguise of Iuz's was not Iuz's idea? A lot of gods were probably happy with his incarceration under Castle Greyhawk. What if they schemed to check the demi-god again? Zagyg, Cuthbert, and maybe some other lesser gods or quasi-deities kidnapped Iuz, forced amnesia on him, and told him he was the lost god Vatun? They got the Suel gods to go along with this, and that is why divination never revealed the Vatun deception.
There is one other thing I could use comments on. I am still working on my Monster Manual revisions (to the exclusion of far too much), and I just recently got to my Cattle entry. Has anyone given any thought to what breeds of cow may be found in the Flanaess? Can someone from Europe give me some names of European breeds of cow?
So far, I have developed three varieties of cow. There is the common (2 HD) Flannish cow. There is the smaller (1 HD) Kettish (or elven) cow which is considered excellent livestock. Then there is the Ideish cow (3 HD) which is strong enough to pull wagons, plows, and can even be rode like a mount (borrowed from the comicbook BONE). Is “Ideish” the word you would use to describe something from Idee?
Scott “Volstagg” Casper
Have fun in Brazil, Erik! Never mind that you've left me with one less Call of Cthulu player!
Sunday, June 7, 2009
Re: [GREYTALK] Ogre-mage PCs
Date sent: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 10:28:23 +1300
Send reply to: rodking
From: rodking
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Ogre-mage PCs
To: GREYTALK@MIVTMA.MIT.EDU
Multi-What Orcs
Me Ug much keen on big-level orcs and orc friends
Good little orc to big orc train rules in DQ by TSR
DQ much just recently re-published (big word Eh!) by TSR orc clan this year
Also called Dragonquest
What dork orc quest for dragon?
Much dangerous but 'spose some that dumb - good treasure tho.
Me suggest you allow - use DQ rules - Good!
Or use Earthdawn rules - much gooder!
Earthdawn even have class of orc called "Liberator"
Liberator orcs real fun. Each time hur they save up damage.
When damage bank full and orcs seek freedom - watch out!
Special attack by liberator can deal all slavery damage back at you!
Best to use on snotty elfs
Me think that orcs in ADandD should advance (nice pronounce Eh?) at 1.5 cost
of normal fighter.
Me think this 'cause orcs have big groups of friends and novelty/shock of
BIG orcs should surpass player.
OROGS also big orcs - lots of levels.
You maybe use orog rules in Monstrous Compendium
ICE and Runequest also advance ork. Much big Uruk-Hai!
Ork MERP/Rolemaster ork pay some penalty 1.2 times xp.
This makes orcs sad but rule makes sense 'cause orcs much strong than ADD orc
and good sissy spelly things too.
You read/play any above for BIG orc rules - much fun. Just change to Greyhawk (nice birdie - Yum)
BIG orcs make sense but not whole tribes. Suggest 1 in 1,000 big orc - like adventurers.
Ug also like big Hobgoblins - especially ties to stake (Heh!). They logical
to advance too as are any half-breed.
Ug pure breed (much proud).
Hope this help
Ug the Eloquent
Sponsored by the "Ug for Pope" campaign CY 598
Send reply to: rodking
From: rodking
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Ogre-mage PCs
To: GREYTALK@MIVTMA.MIT.EDU
Multi-What Orcs
Me Ug much keen on big-level orcs and orc friends
Good little orc to big orc train rules in DQ by TSR
DQ much just recently re-published (big word Eh!) by TSR orc clan this year
Also called Dragonquest
What dork orc quest for dragon?
Much dangerous but 'spose some that dumb - good treasure tho.
Me suggest you allow - use DQ rules - Good!
Or use Earthdawn rules - much gooder!
Earthdawn even have class of orc called "Liberator"
Liberator orcs real fun. Each time hur they save up damage.
When damage bank full and orcs seek freedom - watch out!
Special attack by liberator can deal all slavery damage back at you!
Best to use on snotty elfs
Me think that orcs in ADandD should advance (nice pronounce Eh?) at 1.5 cost
of normal fighter.
Me think this 'cause orcs have big groups of friends and novelty/shock of
BIG orcs should surpass player.
OROGS also big orcs - lots of levels.
You maybe use orog rules in Monstrous Compendium
ICE and Runequest also advance ork. Much big Uruk-Hai!
Ork MERP/Rolemaster ork pay some penalty 1.2 times xp.
This makes orcs sad but rule makes sense 'cause orcs much strong than ADD orc
and good sissy spelly things too.
You read/play any above for BIG orc rules - much fun. Just change to Greyhawk (nice birdie - Yum)
BIG orcs make sense but not whole tribes. Suggest 1 in 1,000 big orc - like adventurers.
Ug also like big Hobgoblins - especially ties to stake (Heh!). They logical
to advance too as are any half-breed.
Ug pure breed (much proud).
Hope this help
Ug the Eloquent
Sponsored by the "Ug for Pope" campaign CY 598
Wednesday, April 22, 2009
Parties, Philidor, Earthdawn
Priority: normal
Date sent: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 21:10:38 CST
Send reply to: The GREYtalk Discussion List GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
From: SCOTT CASPER casper@EMAIL.DOM.EDU
Organization: Dominican Univ., River Forest, IL
Subject: [GREYTALK] Parties, Philidor, Earthdawn (not much GC)
Originally to: greytalk@MIT.EDU
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Lord Moral High-Tone wrote:
>So no more killing in those horrid dungeons of yours.
>From now on it’s a Greyhawk full of Halfling birthday parties only.
If you’re running a campaign like that, count me in! I’m getting tired of putting my characters in danger all the time. What I want some nice, fun scenarios like birthday parties for awhile. I’ve actually been working on a campaign setting for awhile now called Happy Valley, where chaos and evil are practically non-existent. I’ll never find anyone to play it, but I find it good therapy to work on it after a grueling day in the real world.
Paul wrote:
>Phlogiston is later (but the ether is also Green) Phlogiston comes
>from the ideas of English and German philosophers to explain
>propagation of waves through space [snipped]
I was not aware, but I appreciate the correction. At least I was right on everything else, which is pretty good for me.
Noel Graham wrote:
>Actually, if anyone’s interested, I had a discussion with Carl
>Sargent about who Philidor the Blue Wizard was, before he fell from
>the face of the earth [snipped][he means Mr. Sargent, not Philidor]
I thought the list had already decided Philidor was Papa Smurf. Or was he a giant space hamster…?
Ug the Eloquent wrote:
>Me sometime force young orcs to train as well – much gold for older
>orcs!
>Heh!
>Much odd spirit train too (me thinks this system from Earthdawn)
Me not know Earthdawn. What spirit training do? Or do you mean Soul Train? Bad show.
Scott “Volstagg” Casper
Yak-Men agree with Ug. “Cooked elf—Yum!”
Date sent: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 21:10:38 CST
Send reply to: The GREYtalk Discussion List GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
From: SCOTT CASPER casper@EMAIL.DOM.EDU
Organization: Dominican Univ., River Forest, IL
Subject: [GREYTALK] Parties, Philidor, Earthdawn (not much GC)
Originally to: greytalk@MIT.EDU
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Lord Moral High-Tone wrote:
>So no more killing in those horrid dungeons of yours.
>From now on it’s a Greyhawk full of Halfling birthday parties only.
If you’re running a campaign like that, count me in! I’m getting tired of putting my characters in danger all the time. What I want some nice, fun scenarios like birthday parties for awhile. I’ve actually been working on a campaign setting for awhile now called Happy Valley, where chaos and evil are practically non-existent. I’ll never find anyone to play it, but I find it good therapy to work on it after a grueling day in the real world.
Paul wrote:
>Phlogiston is later (but the ether is also Green) Phlogiston comes
>from the ideas of English and German philosophers to explain
>propagation of waves through space [snipped]
I was not aware, but I appreciate the correction. At least I was right on everything else, which is pretty good for me.
Noel Graham wrote:
>Actually, if anyone’s interested, I had a discussion with Carl
>Sargent about who Philidor the Blue Wizard was, before he fell from
>the face of the earth [snipped][he means Mr. Sargent, not Philidor]
I thought the list had already decided Philidor was Papa Smurf. Or was he a giant space hamster…?
Ug the Eloquent wrote:
>Me sometime force young orcs to train as well – much gold for older
>orcs!
>Heh!
>Much odd spirit train too (me thinks this system from Earthdawn)
Me not know Earthdawn. What spirit training do? Or do you mean Soul Train? Bad show.
Scott “Volstagg” Casper
Yak-Men agree with Ug. “Cooked elf—Yum!”
Monday, March 9, 2009
Re: The Haughtiness of Elves
Date: Sun, 05 Dec 99 10:31AM PST
From: Scott Casper Add To Address Book Add To Junk Mail
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] The Haughtiness of Elves
Hi again!
Gary Welsh wrote:
>It is interesting to hear people's different takes on the elves. Here is my take on the haughtiness of
>elves, particularly in regards to the grey elves of Celene. First, put yourself in their shoes:
I'd rather not. I've been biting my tongue, trying to avoid the urge to rip on elves again. Can't...resist...
>You are an elf.
NOOOO!!!!
>You have lived in Celene your entire life, which is several centuries. You are a grey elf. By your
>race's standards, you are in your early middle years.
>You can expect to live another thousand years.
Not likely. Sure, their bodies can theoretically hold out for centuries, but the woosies are more likely to die from the pain if they stub their toe.
>Many of the dwellings in Celene have been carefully >crafted, built, and even grown for many milleniums.
Lawful dwarves have carefully constructed dwellings, millenia in the making. Chaotic elves have slap-dash houses, thrown together in as much time as they can concentrate on one thing, which isn't long. After a while they tire of that dwelling and move on to another.
>[snip]Now really you have nothing *against* these humans -- most of them are ignorant, not evil -- but
>you do not want them in your backyard.
Not that there's anything elves can do about it. At least it's a step up from getting pushed around by kobolds.
>[more snips]That is my take on the attitude of a typical Celenese elf. There is nothing the slightest
>bit evil in there, just a bit of snobbery and isolationism.
The fact that a race so obnoxious could be so snobbish makes me hate them with a passion. That's why I take such an extreme approach. Elves don't get to be snobs because they're nothing but worthless slave stock, to be killed and eaten when any race wants a light snack.
>Also, Celene isn't racist -- its populace is made up of grey elves, wood elves, gnomes, halflings, half-
>elves and humans. There are humans and half-elves in the Celenese military forces. People seem to forget that Celene is *not* an isolationist country of grey
>elves -- it *is* an isolationist country of several races, whose monarch is an elf.
That's an excellent point, and may make Celene easier for me to swallow. The gnomes, halflings, and humans probably are the true rulers of Celene, with the elves being their slaves. The queen is probably a figure-head only, appointed by the other races just to mock the elves.
>[more snips]Those who try get into Celene uninvited are targeted with Sleep, Charm and Forget spells, and then are harmlessly deposited in the forest outside
>the kingdom's borders. Those that persist disappear...
But only if they are low level. Mid-level PCs resist the Sleep spells, make their saves against the other spells, and target the elves by the sound of their spell-casting.
Scott "Volstagg" Casper
Yak-Men serve elf buffet-style...
From: Scott Casper
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] The Haughtiness of Elves
Hi again!
Gary Welsh wrote:
>It is interesting to hear people's different takes on the elves. Here is my take on the haughtiness of
>elves, particularly in regards to the grey elves of Celene. First, put yourself in their shoes:
I'd rather not. I've been biting my tongue, trying to avoid the urge to rip on elves again. Can't...resist...
>You are an elf.
NOOOO!!!!
>You have lived in Celene your entire life, which is several centuries. You are a grey elf. By your
>race's standards, you are in your early middle years.
>You can expect to live another thousand years.
Not likely. Sure, their bodies can theoretically hold out for centuries, but the woosies are more likely to die from the pain if they stub their toe.
>Many of the dwellings in Celene have been carefully >crafted, built, and even grown for many milleniums.
Lawful dwarves have carefully constructed dwellings, millenia in the making. Chaotic elves have slap-dash houses, thrown together in as much time as they can concentrate on one thing, which isn't long. After a while they tire of that dwelling and move on to another.
>[snip]Now really you have nothing *against* these humans -- most of them are ignorant, not evil -- but
>you do not want them in your backyard.
Not that there's anything elves can do about it. At least it's a step up from getting pushed around by kobolds.
>[more snips]That is my take on the attitude of a typical Celenese elf. There is nothing the slightest
>bit evil in there, just a bit of snobbery and isolationism.
The fact that a race so obnoxious could be so snobbish makes me hate them with a passion. That's why I take such an extreme approach. Elves don't get to be snobs because they're nothing but worthless slave stock, to be killed and eaten when any race wants a light snack.
>Also, Celene isn't racist -- its populace is made up of grey elves, wood elves, gnomes, halflings, half-
>elves and humans. There are humans and half-elves in the Celenese military forces. People seem to forget that Celene is *not* an isolationist country of grey
>elves -- it *is* an isolationist country of several races, whose monarch is an elf.
That's an excellent point, and may make Celene easier for me to swallow. The gnomes, halflings, and humans probably are the true rulers of Celene, with the elves being their slaves. The queen is probably a figure-head only, appointed by the other races just to mock the elves.
>[more snips]Those who try get into Celene uninvited are targeted with Sleep, Charm and Forget spells, and then are harmlessly deposited in the forest outside
>the kingdom's borders. Those that persist disappear...
But only if they are low level. Mid-level PCs resist the Sleep spells, make their saves against the other spells, and target the elves by the sound of their spell-casting.
Scott "Volstagg" Casper
Yak-Men serve elf buffet-style...
Friday, October 31, 2008
The Head of Vecna
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] The Head of Vecna
Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 16:39:21 -0800
From: Russ Taylor
Reply-To: The GREYtalk Discussion List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
On 2/17/00 4:07 PM, Bryan Blumklotz (saracen@europa.com) wrote
>
>
> I recently joined a new gaming group in Portland, OR and on the second
> meeting
> I attended someone was describing a particular DM with a nasty sense of
> humor. He
> ran a tournament at a convention, during which, the players were told by a
> "reliable" source where to find the Head of Vecna. Of course the Munchkins
>
[snip]
> When we meet in March I will get the exact details of this romp to
> post up.
That's a fairly famous story, possibly "appropriated" by the person in question. Here ya go:
The Head of Vecna
by Mark F. Steuer
Several members of Group One came up with the idea of luring Group Two into a trap. You remember the Hand of Vecna and the Eye of Vecna that were artifacts in the old D&D world where if you cut off your hand (or your eye) and replaced it with the Hand of Vecna (or the Eye) you'd get new awesome powers? Well, Group One thought up The Head of Vecna.
Group One spread rumors all over the countryside (even paying Bards to spread the word about this artifact rumored to exist nearby). They even went so far as to get a real head and place it under some weak traps to help with the illusion. Unfortunately, they forgot to let ALL the members of their group in on the secret plan (I suspect it was because they didn't want the Druid to get caught and tell the
enemy about this trap of theirs, or maybe because they didn't want him messing with things).
The Druid in group One heard about this new artifact and went off in search of it himself (I believe to help prove himself to the party members...) Well, after much trial and tribulation, he found it; deactivated (or set off) all the traps; and took his "prize" off into the woods for examination. He discovered that it did not radiate magic (a well known trait of artifacts) and smiled gleefully.
I wasn't really worried since he was alone and I knew that there was no way he could CUT HIS OWN HEAD OFF. Alas I was mistaken as the Druid promptly summoned some carnivorous apes and instructed them to use his own scimitar and cut his head off (and of course quickly replacing it with the Head of Vecna...)
Some time later, Group one decided to find the Druid and to check on the trap. They found the headless body (and the two heads) and realized that they had erred in their plan (besides laughing at the character who had played the Druid)... The Head of Vecna still had BOTH eyes! They corrected this mistake and reset their traps and the
Head for it's real intended victims...
Group Two, by this time, had heard of the powerful artifact and decided that it bore investigating since, if true, they could use it to destroy Group One. After much trial and tribulation, they found the resting place of The Head of Vecna! The were particularly impressed with the cunning traps surrounding the site (one almost missed his save against the weakest poison known to man). They recovered the Head and made off to a safe area.
Group Two actually CAME TO BLOWS (several rounds of fighting) against each other argueing over WHO WOULD GET THEIR HEAD CUT OFF! Several greedy players had to be hurt and restrained before it was decided who would be the recipient of the great powers bestowed by the Head... The magician was selected and one of them promptly cut his
head off. As the player was lifting The Head of Vecna to emplace it on it's new body, another argument broke out and they spent several minutes shouting and yelling. Then, finally, they put the Head onto the character.
Well, of course, the Head simply fell off the lifeless body. All members of Group Two began yelling and screaming at each other (and at me) and then, on their own, decided that they had let too much time pass between cutting off the head of a hopeful recipient and put the Head of Vecna onto the body.
SO THEY DID IT AGAIN!... [killing another PC]
In closing, it should be said that I never even cracked a smile as all this was going on. After the second PC was slaughtered, I had to give in (my side was hurting)...
And Group Two blamed ME for all of that...
So let that be a warning to you - don't let your head get cut off unless you really know what you're doing.
Copyright © 1996 Mark F. Steuer
--
Russ Taylor (http://www.cmc.net/~rtaylor/)
CMC Tech Support Manager
"Lord help me, I'm just not that bright." -- Homer
Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 16:39:21 -0800
From: Russ Taylor
Reply-To: The GREYtalk Discussion List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
On 2/17/00 4:07 PM, Bryan Blumklotz (saracen@europa.com) wrote
>
>
> I recently joined a new gaming group in Portland, OR and on the second
> meeting
> I attended someone was describing a particular DM with a nasty sense of
> humor. He
> ran a tournament at a convention, during which, the players were told by a
> "reliable" source where to find the Head of Vecna. Of course the Munchkins
>
[snip]
> When we meet in March I will get the exact details of this romp to
> post up.
That's a fairly famous story, possibly "appropriated" by the person in question. Here ya go:
The Head of Vecna
by Mark F. Steuer
Several members of Group One came up with the idea of luring Group Two into a trap. You remember the Hand of Vecna and the Eye of Vecna that were artifacts in the old D&D world where if you cut off your hand (or your eye) and replaced it with the Hand of Vecna (or the Eye) you'd get new awesome powers? Well, Group One thought up The Head of Vecna.
Group One spread rumors all over the countryside (even paying Bards to spread the word about this artifact rumored to exist nearby). They even went so far as to get a real head and place it under some weak traps to help with the illusion. Unfortunately, they forgot to let ALL the members of their group in on the secret plan (I suspect it was because they didn't want the Druid to get caught and tell the
enemy about this trap of theirs, or maybe because they didn't want him messing with things).
The Druid in group One heard about this new artifact and went off in search of it himself (I believe to help prove himself to the party members...) Well, after much trial and tribulation, he found it; deactivated (or set off) all the traps; and took his "prize" off into the woods for examination. He discovered that it did not radiate magic (a well known trait of artifacts) and smiled gleefully.
I wasn't really worried since he was alone and I knew that there was no way he could CUT HIS OWN HEAD OFF. Alas I was mistaken as the Druid promptly summoned some carnivorous apes and instructed them to use his own scimitar and cut his head off (and of course quickly replacing it with the Head of Vecna...)
Some time later, Group one decided to find the Druid and to check on the trap. They found the headless body (and the two heads) and realized that they had erred in their plan (besides laughing at the character who had played the Druid)... The Head of Vecna still had BOTH eyes! They corrected this mistake and reset their traps and the
Head for it's real intended victims...
Group Two, by this time, had heard of the powerful artifact and decided that it bore investigating since, if true, they could use it to destroy Group One. After much trial and tribulation, they found the resting place of The Head of Vecna! The were particularly impressed with the cunning traps surrounding the site (one almost missed his save against the weakest poison known to man). They recovered the Head and made off to a safe area.
Group Two actually CAME TO BLOWS (several rounds of fighting) against each other argueing over WHO WOULD GET THEIR HEAD CUT OFF! Several greedy players had to be hurt and restrained before it was decided who would be the recipient of the great powers bestowed by the Head... The magician was selected and one of them promptly cut his
head off. As the player was lifting The Head of Vecna to emplace it on it's new body, another argument broke out and they spent several minutes shouting and yelling. Then, finally, they put the Head onto the character.
Well, of course, the Head simply fell off the lifeless body. All members of Group Two began yelling and screaming at each other (and at me) and then, on their own, decided that they had let too much time pass between cutting off the head of a hopeful recipient and put the Head of Vecna onto the body.
SO THEY DID IT AGAIN!... [killing another PC]
In closing, it should be said that I never even cracked a smile as all this was going on. After the second PC was slaughtered, I had to give in (my side was hurting)...
And Group Two blamed ME for all of that...
So let that be a warning to you - don't let your head get cut off unless you really know what you're doing.
Copyright © 1996 Mark F. Steuer
--
Russ Taylor (http://www.cmc.net/~rtaylor/)
CMC Tech Support Manager
"Lord help me, I'm just not that bright." -- Homer
Wednesday, October 29, 2008
Re: Computer game influence on 3e
Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Computer game influence on 3e
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 11:32:39 EST
From: Gary Welsh
Reply-To: The GREYtalk Discussion List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Doom_Bob the Many-Buckled Sorcerer and F@t Earl the Vorpal Cowboy (using new 3e prestige classes) took their henchmen deep into the catacombs of forty-nine arch-liches (in "Against the 49ers and Beyond"). From there they ventured through several Abyssal Gateposts, to kill off a few demon princes and night hag soul-merchants. But even these great heroes (who were not munchkins, by the way, and in fact resented the term) could have bad luck now and then. And when the tides of demon hordes turned against them, Doom_Bob frantically hit a button on his Keyboard of Manifold Powers, while shouting the command words:
"SAVE GAME! SAVE GAME!" Beads of sweat were running down his face. He pressed the button over and over again, but nothing happened. Something was terribly wrong.
"What is it?" F@t Earl shouted over his shoulder, as he barely kept the demon princes at bay.
"Lag! I can't believe it. We may die because of lag!" Doom_Bob cried out incredulously.
"That sucks," F@t Earl said. "If we die here, we'll have to start all the way back in the arch-liches' Hall of Phame. Quick, try ctrl-alt-delete."
Doom_Bob groaned. "I don't want to go through those levels again."
Just then, one of the larger demons (which had a randomly generated "broken" combo of powers), ripped F@t Earl 's head off with a critical hit. "Who's your Daddy!?!" it boomed in deep demonic voice, as it spiked F@t Earl's head off the smoking cave floor, doing a victory dance.
Doom_Bob backed away, whimpering. But there was nowhere to go.
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 11:32:39 EST
From: Gary Welsh
Reply-To: The GREYtalk Discussion List
To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Doom_Bob the Many-Buckled Sorcerer and F@t Earl the Vorpal Cowboy (using new 3e prestige classes) took their henchmen deep into the catacombs of forty-nine arch-liches (in "Against the 49ers and Beyond"). From there they ventured through several Abyssal Gateposts, to kill off a few demon princes and night hag soul-merchants. But even these great heroes (who were not munchkins, by the way, and in fact resented the term) could have bad luck now and then. And when the tides of demon hordes turned against them, Doom_Bob frantically hit a button on his Keyboard of Manifold Powers, while shouting the command words:
"SAVE GAME! SAVE GAME!" Beads of sweat were running down his face. He pressed the button over and over again, but nothing happened. Something was terribly wrong.
"What is it?" F@t Earl shouted over his shoulder, as he barely kept the demon princes at bay.
"Lag! I can't believe it. We may die because of lag!" Doom_Bob cried out incredulously.
"That sucks," F@t Earl said. "If we die here, we'll have to start all the way back in the arch-liches' Hall of Phame. Quick, try ctrl-alt-delete."
Doom_Bob groaned. "I don't want to go through those levels again."
Just then, one of the larger demons (which had a randomly generated "broken" combo of powers), ripped F@t Earl 's head off with a critical hit. "Who's your Daddy!?!" it boomed in deep demonic voice, as it spiked F@t Earl's head off the smoking cave floor, doing a victory dance.
Doom_Bob backed away, whimpering. But there was nowhere to go.
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