Giant Troubles, PS GH Revisionism

 From: Otto Zequeira [OTETA@AOL.COM]

Sent: unday, September 20, 1998 10:05 PM

To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU

Subject: [GREYTALK] Giant Troubles, PS GH Revisionism

The Giant Troubles

On Sun, 13 Sep 1998 12:11 :34 -0500, Vashnaar Q Mithruin <vashnaar@RR1 .NET> asked, "I need to nail down he month and year that the Giants and Humanoids invaded Sterich and Geoff. I figure Susebb 583-Fireseek 584. Any other ideas or suggestions would be helpful. I know there are those of you that thrive on placing events and dates."

I wrote down Goodmonth of CY 583, but I can't begin to tell you why right now because I don't remember.

"Are there any modules, post invasion of that area, that i might be able to get ahold of??"

GDQ1-7 works fine here, due to contradictory placement of the modules in the timeline.

PS GH revisionism

On Thu, 17 Sep 1998 20:05:26 -0400, Ubiquitous <weberm@POLARIS.NET> wrote,"« One might also add in the silliness about certain oerthly powers that appeared in On Hallowed ground. » Oh yeah, that too ... "

What's the word on this? I seem to have missed the news. Was this the stuff about WoGH dieties being dead, or GH dying?

**********************************************************************

The GREYtalk Discussion List LISTADMIN: owner-greytalk@mitvma.mit.edu

**********************************************************************

Questions? Ask the ADMIN (or look for the new archival address soon.) Try the GT FAQ: http://members.aol.com/SavantSage/greytalk/greyfaq.txt

**********************************************************************

To unsubscribe, send "SIGNOFF GREYTALK" to listserv@mitvma.mit.edu or, to toggle the digest mode send "SET GREYTALK DIGEST (or NODIGEST)" For complete LISTSERV commands, send "INFO REFCARD" to the listserver.

******************************************************************

Timelines, GDQ and ToEE

 From: Keith Horsfield <afn09454@AFN.ORG>

To: ("GREYTALK@mitvma.mit.edu")

Date: Sat, Jul 25, 1998 1:44 PM

Subject: Re: [GREYTALK] Timelines, GDQ and ToEE

Otto Zequeira wrote:

>Timelines

> T1-4 says that Lolth received a sharp check to her plans, and consequently grew interested in the ToEE. On the flip side, GDQ1-7, which is the 'sharp check' that the module mentions, is placed after the ToEE in the series.

I only own the individual modules of the GDQ series. These modules were written previously in Real Time to T1-4. The inconsistency only comes into play when a DM desires to run a single party through a 'classic campaign' which many consider to be T1-4, A1-4 and then GDQ1-7 with some of the S modules thrown in.

As to the timeline of the GDQ series, I've always placed them prior to 576 CY due to being referenced in the 1980 World of Greyhawk Gazetteer. The Village of Hommlet is also mentioned in the Gazetteer which meshes with the fact that the Battle of Emridy Meadows took place in 569 CY.

>This solution allows the GDQ1-7 to be tied with the Greyhawk Wars invasion of Geoff and Sterich, which is so strikingly similar to the module. I think that Cook may have had this in mind when he wrote "Greyhawk Wars". He is one of the contributing writers to GDQ1-7 after all. This would need confirmation, though.

I think the remnants of the GDQ series was the basis for what happened in Geoff and Sterich, but I believe this was just Lolth through the giants reasserting her power once the joint endeavor at ToEE fails.

>Also, the World of Greyhawk Gazetteer places the Battle of Emridy Meadows at 569 CY, and T1-4 says that for five years later, things were good in Hommlett, but that in the last year banditry has risen (5). This means that the start of the module is about 575-6, which the Gazetteer also says is the time of its own writing.

First, where does the Gazetter say this?

Second, I disagree with your start time for ToEE based on the following, all of which can be found on pg. 5 of ToEE. Starting with the base date of 569 CY for the Battle of Emridy Meadows

Last paragraph 1st column:

"For five years afterward, the village and the countryside have become richer and more prosperous then ever before."

In this paragraph is the mention of the troll and how it was killed by some adventurers. After that adventurers continue to come but find nothing.

1st full paragraph, 2nd column:

"-- and Hommlet continued its quiet existence for four years more."

The beginning of this paragraph states that adventurers have stopped coming to the area.

2nd full paragraph, 2nd column:

"But then, a year ago, the bandits began to ride the roads again ... From my reading of these 3 paragraphs there are 3 distinct periods after the Battle of Emridy Meadows for the village of Hommlet:

1) 5 years where adventurers continue to visit brought by wanderlust

2) 4 years where the village is left in peace

3) 1 year of rising banditry

Therefore, T1-4 is supposed to take place in 579 CY.

>Consequently, I find that Steve W. starts the GDQ series too early in his timeline by placing it on 566, and Ed Zeamba starts T1-4 too late by placing it on 580.

Actually, I tend to agree with these dates. However, there is one other module, WG8, that assumes T1-4 takes place in or prior to 576 CY. Then again, I think the official date of 576 CY for WG8 to be far too early in the timeline. WG8 is supposed to take place 1,000 years after the founding of the Scarlet Brotherhood, which is given as 5091 SD. However, in the Verbobonc section, the author places the module 'a couple of years' after the completion of the castle in Hommlet. IMO, this module should be placed around 581 CY based on the latter. The date given in the Scarlet Masque is based on a prophecy of what is supposed to happen, not what already has happen. How many prophecies occur when they are supposed to? At least IMC, this one came about 5 years after it was supposed to.

Keith Horsfield

Member Team OS/2

"To a person with a hammer, everything looks like a nail"

E-mail: afn09454@afn.org

Home page: http://www.afn.org/~afn09454/

Re: GDQ1-7 campaign (Titans)

Subject:
Re: [GREYTALK] GDQ1-7 campaign (Titans)
Date:
Tue, 23 Mar 1999 10:47:34 -0800
From:
Chris Anderson
Reply-To:
The GREYtalk Discussion List


IMC he was Gorgonstar (name stolen from the old Fineous Fingers cartoons), and was part of Eclavdra's plans.

He was to be transported into the Vault for use in her fight against the other noble houses and the Illithid). She had found means of compelling his obedience. Had the party not rescued him, he would have been used against them in later adventures.

Since the party did rescue him, he granted them one service in exchange for his freedom. In one of the more brilliant moves that this party ever did, they asked for his friendship instead, and then proceeded to back that up by doing him a service.

In one stroke, they gained the active friendship of a being that had existed in the Flanaess for more than 13,000 years (IMC Titans are immortal). That was worth much to them in later adventures.

--
Chris Anderson

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Thomas E Morris [mailto:temorris@pacbell.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 1999 10:07 AM
> To: GREYTALK@mitvma.mit.edu
> Subject: [GREYTALK] GDQ1-7 campaign (Titans)
>
> In G3 there is a Titan the the Fire Giants are holding
> prisoner. That's the only Greyhawk reference I can think of. Does anyone know who
the Titan is and how he became a prisoner?
>
> Have fun,
> Tom
> Temorris@pacbell.net
>
> ICQ# 30987170
> -----Original Message-----
> From: CJ MacLean
> To: GREYTALK@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Date: Tuesday, March 23, 1999 2:02 AM
> Subject: [GREYTALK] GDQ1-7 campaign (Titans)
>
>
> >This discussion seems more or less over, but I read one post
> that suggested that Titans be added to the giants arsenal to create a more difficult
> >adventure.
> >
> >This got me thinking about Titans and their role in
> Greyhawk's pantheons of gods.
> >Off the top of my head, I can't think of a single Greyhawk
> reference where Titans are mentioned (I am not saying one doesn't exist, I
> just can't think of any).
> >As I understand 2nd edition rules, Titans don't live on the
> Prime Material plane(but they do visit). Did a battle between gods and
> Titans happen on Oerth(like the Greek Mythos)?
> >Are Titans the earthly avatars of the Greyhawk deities? Of a
> particular pantheon of gods (Flan, Oerid, etc.)?
> >Were Titans the servants of Tharizdun, driven away by his
> incarceration, or some other Titanic(heehee) event?
> >
> >The door seems wide open to creatively use these folks, I
> would be curious to hear how the people who have done extensive research/writing on
> >Greyhawk's gods feel about their inclusion in the various pantheons.
> >
> >CJ
> >
> >==========

G Module Characters (long)

Subject: [GREYTALK] G Module Characters (long)
Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 01:08:18 -0500
From: Robbie Bowman
Reply-To: The GREYtalk Discussion List

Hi all,

On the subject of updating G module pregenerated characters, I have worked up a little bit of background on some of the characters for use as NPC's in my own campaign. I had plans to do them all as well as the pregen. Characters from other modules as well, but real life has prevented me from this for now. Here's what I made up for Frush O'Suggil (the 14th lv human fighter) I have also worked up stuff for a couple of other ones IIRC.

Sir Cedric Dorannian, Eldest son of House Dorannian of Nyrond. (Frush O' Suggil)

Cedric Dorannian was born in the city of Rel Mord in 559 C.Y. His father was a powerful lord, and an advisor to King Archbold. His mother was was a beautiful high born lady. Their family owned a mansion in Rel Mord, and a hereditary estate outside the city. The Dorannian family had been held in high esteem by the Royal Family for the last two and a half centuries.

His mother, in her years with his father, had gained his complete trust, and was informed of the King's latest policies, decrees, and secrets. Her beauty and charm hid her lust for power though, and she had long since seen an opportunity for herself, using her husband's position as a stepping stone. She began working with an Aerdi spy, and through her influence, he was secreted into the Royal Court in disguise, allowing him to spy on the King directly. They began to make dark plans in secret, and Cedric's mother also began to become more enamoured with her co-conspirator.

Cedric was given the best upbringing possible, growing up around royalty, even playing childhood games with young Prince Lynwerd. He had earned his knighthood at eighteen, after years of being a squire, and went on small raids into the Bone March, Adri Forest, and the dark undercity of Oldred in search of adventure. His mother, and her secret contact had set their plans in motion. King Archbold and the young Princes were to be killed, leaving Nyrond in chaos, and open to attack from the Great Kingdom. Ivid's mad plans called for Nyrond to be conquered as the first step in the Great Kingdom's return to Empire.

The plan came close to working, it was discovered at the last minute by the King's personal security guards. There was furious combat in the halls of the Royal Palace as the assassins were flushed out and killed, however, Cedric's mother was never found. Apparently she had escaped with her secret love. She was never seen again.

The shock that a member of the Dorannian family had betrayed the King and Nyrond was incredible. Rumor began to spread, first through the Royal Court, then through Rel Mord, and on to the rest of Nyrond, that his father had known of the plan, but loved his wife so, that he kept silent for fear of her punishment. Some in the Royal Court demanded that his father be removed from his position, and stripped of his lands and title. He was eventually removed from his position, but not stripped of land or title. His father's life had been turned upside down, though, and he fell into depression and drink. No one in Nyrond fully trusted anyone in the family anymore.

Cedric was deeply disturbed, and went on wild and often near suicidal adventures, seeking to keep his mind off the troubles at home. He traveled across the Flanaess fighting for justice anywhere he could, and joined in a campaign against giants in the Crystalmist Mountains in 578 CY, just one year after the betrayal.

When he returned, he went on several more adventures, desperately dangerous quests, personal missions into the Great Kingdom, to try and learn what he could about his treacherous mother and her whereabouts. He became involved in dark intrigue, back alley combats with assassins, and other run ins with danger. His skill carried him through those fights, but he could not find a trace of his mother. In such a large and and corrupt land, it was near impossible anyway.

Just before the Wars, his father finally slipped away, after a long slide through depression and alcohol. The title of Lord Dorannian passed to Cedric. He refused to accept his lands and title until he had brought his mother and the Aerdy spy, who he believed had corrupted her, to justice.

During the Wars, he fought with distinction in the Flinty Hills, the Eastern Plains, and Almorian Borderlands. He participated in the retaking of Almor in 586, and was honored by his old friend, now King, Lynwerd. His deeds had done much to restore the family honor, and the King officially pardoned his family for his mother's betrayal. He was even offered his father's old position as advisor to the King, or a Field Generalship. But he politely refused, and vowed never to settle down until he found his mother and brought her back to Nyrond to face justice.

He has tracked down rumors that the couple escaped the fall of the Great Kingdom and fled westward in disguise. In the last couple of years, he has searched through the Unrst States, Greyhawk City, Furyondy, Veluna, and he is now moving into the Sheldomar Valley. He has an overwhelming sense of justice and goodness that compels him to help those in need that he meets along the way.

Robbie Bowman